We All Live in a Yellow Failmarine

[hector_rashbaum]

Although the initial post frustrated the fuck out of me and hit several knee-jerk buttons at once, I was actually enjoying the comments in gerriwritinglog's Racism, RaceFail '09, and the Meme post. There were lots of excellent informative comments there, a few comments from the OP that made me less ragey, and some useful conversations were happening.

Obviously, that could not be allowed to continue.

I want to respond to the shutdown comment, but first there are a few threads I want to call attention to:

* leana106 on the difference between "black and proud" and "white pride"

* sinsense, who consistently brings the awesome in that post, about the importance of deferring to someone whose knowledge of the subject is greater than your own

* sleepingfear, also ridiculously awesome, posts an excellent video clip and a good explanation of the problem with "color-blind" in this thread.

There's plenty more good stuff, but those are the specifics that stood out to me as I was reading/participating.

And just for context, my response to/conversation with the OP.

ETA: gerriwritinglog disabled comments, effectively deleting everything (and rendering my links pointless). But the Firefox cache is a beautiful thing, I've got a screenshot here, all comments unfolded. I'm keeping the links on the off chance she de-disables.

Son of ETA: She's de-disabled; I'm keeping the screenshot linked anyway.

As far as shutting down goes...well.

"Now, thanks to a couple much appreciated commenters, I have something to continue my growth with."

...

"I have a couple characters who are just as self-righteous as I came off in my OP. The reactions that you, the commenters, gave me help ENORMOUSLY in clarifying how these characters will act and react, as well as the people who will work to change them."

Okay, folks, you have served your purpose, now kindly run along. I've learned all I've decided I need to, please get the fuck out.

That may only bother me because of the reason I like debating/discussing/etc. on LJ - because the conversations aren't only about the people having them, they're about all the unseen readers who might come along tomorrow, a month from now, a year from now, and see something that makes them go "...ohhhhhh, that's it; I get it now".

When you post something publicly, especially when it ends up somewhere like metafandom where it will attract a buttload of people who don't know you and don't care - they're drawn by the topic, not the poster - it's really not entirely about you. It becomes about the commenters and the readers as well; to shut it down because you, specifically, don't feel you have anything more to gain, you're taking something that developed beyond you and closing it back in again; you're depriving the people who do have more to gain from the conversations that were benefiting them.

All of which, I suppose, any given individual has the right to do when he or she controls the space. Perhaps I'm just bothered by how blatant the "whatever else you think you have to teach me doesn't matter, because I've learned it all now" attitude is.

And that's not even what really bothered me.

I would ask that if you take away one thing from this thread, it's that it's not enough to say "You don't understand." Follow up with "Let me tell you about what happened to me." Racism, to white people, is very often dealt with in the abstract. Making the problem concrete with a real example makes a difference to those struggling to understand.

This, immediately after this:

It's no one's duty to bare their souls to you for your own education, which is what you're asking when you expect someone to follow up "you don't understand the specific issues I face as a POC" with "and here's what they all are". You're saying "I want you to take something that has caused you pain, or shame, or harm, and I want you to write about it, relive it, and I want you to put it out there for public consumption where people will question it, pull it apart, demand to know more, and I want you to do all this so I can learn".

There are explanations out there, there are people who have chosen to educate, to turn elements of their life into a learning experience for white people. Every time, or nearly every time, there's a blowout over racism in fandom, it's because someone has chosen to speak up about the specific way in which she, as a POC, has been made to feel uncomfortable, out of place, like a lesser person because of the multitude of problems with race so prevalent in fandom. When those so often end so badly, I'm certainly not going to be the one to blame POC for not wanting to put their hardships out there for white people to pull apart.

deepad's I Didn't Dream of Dragons post at the genesis of this latest conversation is one of those - look at how big this has gotten, how many people have gotten hurt, all the consequences, and understand that when you say "explain this to me" you're asking someone to risk all that for your benefit.

Any faith I had that the OP truly learned from the experience, that she took all those attempts to educate her to heart, flew right out the window when all she had to say to "it's nobody's job to educate you" was "thanks for the education, and remember, it's everyone's job to teach me shit".

Maybe she locked down too early.

Comments

[leana106.livejournal.com]

Holy crap, someone thinks I said something interesting; this pleases me inordinately. :D

I was so pissed about the discussion being shut down because 1. I wanted to see her response to a couple of posts, mostly the one about her Emmett Till comparison and the posts about how its not the job of POC to educate her, especially when the stuff she's looking for is easily available and 2. some really interesting articles were being posted and I wanted to see more discussion about them.

Okay, folks, you have served your purpose, now kindly run along. I've learned all I've decided I need to, please get the fuck out.

YES!! That dismissive tone made me see red; I really couldn't believe that someone could construct that kind of response to that kind of discussion with a straight face.

Any faith I had that the OP truly learned from the experience, that she took all those attempts to educate her to heart, flew right out the window when all she had to say to "it's nobody's job to educate you" was "thanks for the education, and remember, it's everyone's job to teach me shit".

I knew as soon as she clarified (but not really) her comments about Emmett Till, that she wasn't really trying to learn anything. And really, if she thinks that anything said in her post was "really really nasty," then she must be new to the internet. There was a lot of hand-holding and being nice to her that generally doesn't happen when you've shown your ass the way she had.

*looks up* Long comment is long. Anyway, I am in full agreement with all the stuff you've said here, and I really appreciate your level headed comments to her, because I just couldn't get anything civil out.

[hector-rashbaum.livejournal.com]

I appreciated your comment because so often the explanation is along the lines of "because white people are privileged and POC are not" and while that's accurate, it counts on the other person accepting the basic truth of white privilege - which infuriatingly few people do. You managed to illustrate the exact same difference in a more...accessible, for lack of a better word, way.

And shutdowns always piss me off anyway - even if the conversations are mostly over, you never know what might come in. I usually subscribe to posts I find interesting, and then forget to unsubscribe - sometimes the most insightful, interesting comments come in months after the fact.

But to shut down a number of conversations held by really fantastic people full of really fantastic information right in the middle? That says everything that has to be said about how much you respect the time and energy spent educating your ignorant ass.

And the Emmett Till thread was a special brand of fail.

[leana106.livejournal.com]

I appreciated your comment because so often the explanation is along the lines of "because white people are privileged and POC are not" and while that's accurate, it counts on the other person accepting the basic truth of white privilege - which infuriatingly few people do. You managed to illustrate the exact same difference in a more...accessible, for lack of a better word, way.

Thanks. Privilege as a whole seems to get people up in a dander; if I can explain something without using it, then I try to go that way. At some point that doesn't work, but at least they get it up til that point.

But to shut down a number of conversations held by really fantastic people full of really fantastic information right in the middle? That says everything that has to be said about how much you respect the time and energy spent educating your ignorant ass.

I just found it really interesting that when people were really starting to disagree with her and be more blunt, she froze everything and made a 'gracious' post thanking everyone for their input. It reminded me a lot of one of the links I came across today (either through metafandom or rydra_wong) that talked about how this white female college student was basically chastising the Black Student Union for making her feel 'uncomfortable' when she went into their space for whatever reason. And so she wrote this long ass article in the student newspaper calling out black people to make white people/allies more welcome when there's a racism topic. I'll have to see if I can find it, because it was a truly stunning example of RL 'ally' fail. The woman (and OP) managed to turn a discussion about racism into something all about them, which is something that happens a lot in race discussion, sadly.

And the Emmett Till thread was a special brand of fail.

You know, I didn't think that her clarification on what she really meant could make things worse, but sweet Jesus, I was wrong.

[hector-rashbaum.livejournal.com]

I think outside of race/gender/etc. activism, "privilege" carries a lot of class connotations - so often when someone encounters "white privilege" for the first time their denials are monetary ("I never had a pony", "I wore hand-me-downs", etc.). People get too hung up on the fact that what they think is being said is untrue, rather than whether what is actually being said applies or not. It's dual limitations - the English language only has so many words, and why fish for a new one when "privilege" really does apply, and the self-imposed limitation of not fully engaging with a conversation, of relying on assumptions rather than critical thinking.

And what I found disheartening was I had just started coming to see her as clueless but honestly willing to learn, which I can totally identify with, when she shut down and rather emphatically showed she had no desire to learn a goddamned thing.

And link away; I flock when I don't want to be linked :)

[drlense.livejournal.com]

(I don't mean to butt in, but) Exactly- "privilege" to most white people means that they didn't grow up rich and spoiled and gorgeous. I think some people also initially see it as discounting any real-life hardship that they did persevere through, and then there's a subset of those folks who get really really really hung up on how hard their lives were. They can't disconnect the racial part of it from the social or economic part, and refuse to understand that while they may have had hard lives, that's not what's being talked about right now.

[leana106.livejournal.com]

Butt in all you like. :D

Yes! Whenever someone mentions racial privilege, it seems the whole thing gets derailed into classism because a lot of people believe that a poverty negates any other privilege one might have.

I think some people also initially see it as discounting any real-life hardship that they did persevere through, and then there's a subset of those folks who get really really really hung up on how hard their lives were.

I couldn't have said it any better. We're not discounting the fact that their life was/is hard; its just that race often adds a whole other level to things.

[drlense.livejournal.com]

Exactly- (and thank you!) privilege = being given something, not having had to work for it, and most white people just don't think about race this way. It's so hard for some people to get past that definition to the racial meaning.

And then privilege = spoiled = bad/ungrateful/lazy. We're not supposed to be those things- ESPECIALLY as Americans. We're supposed to have pulled ourselves up from nothing, and worked hard for what we had. Some people (Sh!tterly springs to mind) have made that so much part of their personal identity and who they are and why they're BETTER than the people around them that any kind of challenge throws them into a defensive tizzy that they can't get past.

Part of me wonders if for the lj/sff community, the "you don't know how hard my life was!" is related to the geek social fallacy (everyone hated me in high school edition) but maybe I'm simplifying that too much.

[leana106.livejournal.com]

You're welcome.

Yes, especially because white privilege isn't something that's easily visible. I notice when I'm followed around shops like I'm about to steal something or when I can't get someone to help me--this doesn't happen to most white people, so it's not on their radar as a privilege--it's a given that no one assume that they're in a store to steal stuff or that if they need help, the staff will help them willingly. And that's just a little example; let's not talk about the other discrimination that's been proven to take place.

Some people (Sh!tterly springs to mind) have made that so much part of their personal identity and who they are and why they're BETTER than the people around them that any kind of challenge throws them into a defensive tizzy that they can't get past.

Yes, and that's the bad part. It's like criticizing religion; for all the good it's done, it's done some horrible things as well, and just pointing that out gets some people so upset, you'd think they'd murdered their entire family. No matter how nicely you point it out, there will always be the defensive reaction because "I'm nice, I can't be those things" or even better, "Well, everyone's a little bit racist, who are you to call me out on mine?"

I think that could be part of it, but I usually encounter that line of thinking on political boards where not everyone is a geek/nerd/what have you. I can't speak to RL because I flat out don't discuss this stuff with other people unless it's a safe space (God, I hate that word, but it's the only one that fits).

[drlense.livejournal.com]

Yes, and that's the bad part. It's like criticizing religion; for all the good it's done, it's done some horrible things as well, and just pointing that out gets some people so upset, you'd think they'd murdered their entire family. No matter how nicely you point it out, there will always be the defensive reaction...

The religion analogy is a very good one. And the defensiveness- it's tough. I struggle with it myself- it's so easy to cross over from "wow, we had really different reactions to that show/book/experience" to "you're WRONG!" Defensiveness is like a barrier that protects you from critical thinking. Not to mention that there's way too many people trying to make the discussion about them.

[leana106.livejournal.com]

Defensiveness is like a barrier that protects you from critical thinking. Not to mention that there's way too many people trying to make the discussion about them.

Exactly, and I think that's what pissed me off the most about the original post and the subsequent replies (aside from the spoon feed me your personal experiences or it doesn't count implication). And I'd add about their pet issues--the common derailment of 'its all about class anyway,' If all class issues were waved away tomorrow, we'd still have racism.

Do you mind if I friend you? You sound like an awesome person (and not just because you're agreeing with me. :D)

[drlense.livejournal.com]

That and the defensiveness on behalf of OTHER people- that's the kicker. If it's hard to say that we ourselves are deserving of criticism, then sometimes it's even harder to say our friends are deserving of it.

The class stuff- it's ridiculous. I understand how (as we said above) it's easy to go there first when the word privilege first comes out, but once it's explained to you (and so many people in this have explained it so, so well) it's not hard to figure out. That's the thing that's killed me- these people are supposed to be the smart ones! The intellectuals- the writers, the professional readers. I'm the idiot here! If I can get this, how hard can it be?

You can totally friend me! (I was thinking about asking you the same, earlier.) Although to be honest, I'm not usually this thinky.

[leana106.livejournal.com]

Yes, a thousand times yes. The dumb part is that this all started over literary criticism, something that every author has to deal with. That's the way writing works.

That's the thing that's killed me- these people are supposed to be the smart ones! The intellectuals- the writers, the professional readers. I'm the idiot here! If I can get this, how hard can it be?

Yeah, I know. I think this is a deliberate case of not getting it, because there's nothing wrong with their faculties.

Heh, don't worry, neither am I. Most of my journal is complaining or fangirly squealing.

[sparkymonster.livejournal.com]

Helpful links for discussing what privilege is
http://www.redroom.com/blog/tim-wise/this-your-nation-white-privilege-updated
http://seamonkey.ed.asu.edu/~mcisaac/emc598ge/Unpacking.html

Hit post too soon.

[leana106.livejournal.com]

Also, I sent a link to this post to rydra_wong for inclusion in her link round ups. I hope you don't mind.

[elspethdixon.livejournal.com]

Oh. My. God. People joke about the people on the internet claiming that it was "all a social experiment" after getting called out for something, but I think this is the first time I've seen someone on LJ actually step up and say "O HAI, I was just manipulating all y'all for my own private benefit/the LOLZ."

"I have a couple characters who are just as self-righteous as I came off in my OP. The reactions that you, the commenters, gave me help ENORMOUSLY in clarifying how these characters will act and react, as well as the people who will work to change them

And she couldn't have gotten this from, say, watching Scalzi's blog? Or Elizabeth Bear's "cease fire" post and the responses to that?

[hector-rashbaum.livejournal.com]

I've seen "social experiment", but never quite like this - usually you can tell when it's coming because the person listens less and less, gets more and more defensive, and then bammo OH GOD SHUT UP I WAS JUST JOKING. She had been engaging, and I was starting to actually believe she wanted to learn.

Of course not. She's a very special and unique snowflake and needed a tailor-made experience for her work. POC only exist as educational tools and a means to ~flavor~ white artistry, so why not take advantage?

[cobrasnaps.livejournal.com]

I've never seen this meme before. I'm actually interested in writing my own response. There's a lot of links and to be honest, I just don't have the patience or time to read all of it. I read the entry to this one you speak of, but that's about it. So, I don't know if people have brought up the experience of being bi-racial, as in, you come from two distinct backgrounds, and are shunned from both, but you try to fit in one, and yet you don't. Then there is the whole discrimination I faced not because of the color of my skin, but because of my heritage, being the only Jew *and* Hispanic at a predominately Asian/South Asian/Middle Eastern school. And then the whole what it's like being someone of white skin, but you don't identify yourself as white, you see the tan skin deep down underneath, but it doesn't show on top. It's something I've faced my entire life personally, all of that, so... yeah, I'd like to make a response, but I need to know what this is all about, lol. Race has always been a hot button issue of mine, because I faced a discrimination, and seen my family be discriminated against, but not me, because of my skin color.

[hector-rashbaum.livejournal.com]

Check out rydra_wong's links if you want everything - she's a linking goddess. But when I say "everything" I mean everything, several months' worth of posts, and more all the time.

This (http://snacky.livejournal.com/560654.html?thread=5172494#t5172494) is an excellent summary, as is this (http://wistfuljane.livejournal.com/218945.html). Most of metafandom for the past few weeks has been all about RaceFail '09.

[cobrasnaps.livejournal.com]

That's why I mean, I saw all those links in her journal, and I was like, "Oh hell no, I can't read all of that," lol.

Thanks for the later links though. :) That is awesome. I'll post tonight, even if the topic is already done.

[hector-rashbaum.livejournal.com]

I don't think it's anywhere near done, TBH. It might be winding down...but I thought that once already. Good things are coming out of it, though, like a lot of asshats being exposed as such, and verb_noire. Not that any of that's worth the hurt that's been caused.

And FYI the "meme" mentioned is a "put this in your LJ if you..." kind of thing, although I can't remember off the top of my head who proposed/started it.

[elf]

As long as we've got a big heaping pile of manure, we might as well start using it for fertilizer.

Which doesn't mean anyone wanted a big heaping pile of manure in their homes. But as long as it's here, just as well not to waste what good *can* be extracted from it.

[ticketsonmyself.livejournal.com]

rydra_wong's most recent link digest included a link to Ann Somerville's summary/timeline (http://logophilos.net/blather/?p=1162), a really concise and excellent recap of events from the beginning through now. Somerville lists links and descriptions of the actions of all major players, the conversation's multiple derails, and explanations of how each of the derails has been about race, and racism, and often sexism too.

[sleepingfear.livejournal.com]

Wow, it's always amazing to me when I feel like I just stated the obvious and it turns out to really make a difference. Thank you for the shout-out. You brought a lot of awesome to the post as well.

[hector-rashbaum.livejournal.com]

I'm always impressed when people can talk to someone like the OP, who started out so defensive and didn't initially show signs of getting less so, and actually make them understand.

(I don't buy for a second that she was faking it for a novel; exaggerated, possibly, but to fake it entirely would require a talent and awareness I don't think the person who wrote the shut-down comment possesses. So that can't be the reason she accepted your comments with grace ;])

And thank you :)

[sleepingfear.livejournal.com]

She actually sent me a message about it, so her reaction was definitely real. The shutdown was really weird... I think you're right on that account--exaggerated, certainly, but faking it? Not a chance in hell.

[dharma-slut.livejournal.com]

I am positive that she was "method acting."

[elf]

I was hoping she was just clueless. Annoyingly clueless, offensively clueless, but honestly seeking clues.

I can tolerate "please spoon-feed me specific experiences so I can believe racism is real and active and affects individual people because I can't understand statistics about income levels and education levels and health problems and percentages of actors of color in blockbuster movies." I don't like it, but I can understand how someone can be overwhelmed by statistics, not sure what they mean on an individual level, and want small, simple, anecdotal evidence.

(This is not where I put the 8-page rant on the evils of building theories based on a handful of anecodotes.)

It's nobody's obligation to educate her... but it's also not like we lack volunteers who are quick with a link or two or forty-three.

If she'd just not stopped listening, she'd've been inundated with stories and links and experiences of racism. And I'm much disappointed to discover that's not what she actually wanted; she wanted to "engage the Racefail discussions," and declare that racism is no worse than growing up with Bad Parent Stigma in a small town, and yell "TONE!" long before anyone had actually gotten more than mildly sharp at her.

I was hopeful when she said "Putting up a topic like this is pretty much an invitation to a hijacking. As long as it doesn't devolve to namecalling, I'm good." That sounded like "I know I said some controversial stuff, and I'm open to anything it brings."

And then, umm... she apparently decided that "namecalling" meant "telling her that no, she didn't understand, and she STILL didn't understand."

[hector-rashbaum.livejournal.com]

I'd even gone past hoping she was clueless-but-willing to believing she was clueless-but-willing; she posted her "ok, I've learned, thanks, now get out" comment just shortly after I'd decided that, actually.

And no, I don't see a problem with wanting to see something more personal than statistics - but Google's just a few keystrokes away even if you can't get someone to toss a few links your way. Expecting custom anecdotes on-demand from any POC you happen to offend so much you end up in a "you don't understand" conversation is approaching levels of entitlement previously thought unattainable.

She wanted to talk about how awesome she is for being color-blind, because we all know anyone who isn't is racist, and how logical she is for figuring out that POC aren't the only ones who face challenges in life, and how above-it-all she is by not bowing to the whiners. And I'd bet good money she just wanted anecdotes so she could respond with "oh yeah, that's just like the one time I got made fun of for wearing glasses" and feel secure in her knowledge she has it just as hard as any POC, only she doesn't whine.

[elf]

I was watching her say ..."but... but... but..." (she should do something about the tugboat caught in her throat) and could almost feel her being right on the edge of actually understanding something... and then she slammed it all down and walked away.

And while I'd like to believe that there's some shred of a chance that something got through, that she really *did* understand (how offensive it is to imply Emmett Till caused his own murder / that "white pride" is a ridiculous statement / why color is not the same as poverty for measuring oppressions / etc), but she was just unable to articulate that understanding in a fast-moving discussion... umm. She claims to be an author; that means she's responsible for the meaning people take from her words. (Everyone is, but we give more leeway those whose profession isn't "get ideas out of my head and into other heads via text.")

I hadn't even considered that she'd respond to examples with "I've been there! My ex-boyfriend used to say something just like that to me, after we broke up!" Shudder. I suppose I'm rather glad she stopped before we read that.

[dharma-slut.livejournal.com]

Elfwreck, she was lying.
The whole thing-- that was her character talking, not her real life experience.

She's creating an ignorant white girl with a Flannery O'Connor background.

And it sounds to me like some Magic Negro is going to save her character's ass.

[elf]

I don't think so. Or not entirely. I think she got caught in overt racism, and tried to fall back on "well, that's not really what I think; I was just projecting how my character would talk."

She said, "I have a couple characters who are just as self-righteous as I came off in my OP"--acknowledging that she knew how she was perceived, but trying to dodge realizing that she was perceived that way because that's how she acted. She didn't say, "I posted as my character," or "My character is both clueless and antagonistic, and that was interesting to project." (I somehow doubt she believes she was either clueless or antagonistic.)

But earlier, in response to the bingo card, she said, "I'm only saying what I really think." (And that of course, it's coincidental that it sounds like racism, because we're talking about race, and EVERYTHING sounds like racism when you're talking race.)

And her casual replies to the comments show that really, that's how she thinks. Races that aren't hers are exotic conditions that exist for her entertainment (and possibly education), and when she doesn't understand something, it's someone's duty to explain it to her--in nice sweet bite-sized pieces, so she can understand it and feel happy about herself.

I think she's trying to play two games at once:
1) I am poor oppressed white woman, and I understand all forms of oppression because of that, and anyone who says otherwise is not understanding meeeee, and

2) I am a Writer, and that means everyone else's life experiences are raw materials for my craft, thanks so much for giving me a chapter or two, but now I'm done and bored with you, so go away.

And she wants people to pick whichever of those offends them less so they'll leave her alone--and has missed that they're not incompatible and plenty of people will catch both messages at once, plus the unspoken "People of color are just weird and touchy and I don't understand them, and anyway why should I bother to try?"

[leana106.livejournal.com]

I think I love you for this comment. :D

[elf]

*blush* Thank you.

To be fair, I was probably giving her credit for more sense than she had; up until she locked the posts, I thought she was honestly listening. Cluelessly listening, in that whiny "but what does that mean to meeeee?" way, but paying attention and considering what people were saying.

I still am not sure if she never was listening, or if some of it trickled through, and she got uncomfortable and froze everything so she wouldn't have to get more uncomfortable.

[leana106.livejournal.com]

No prob, that is an excellent comment.

I still am not sure if she never was listening, or if some of it trickled through, and she got uncomfortable and froze everything so she wouldn't have to get more uncomfortable.

I dearly hope so, but I'm not sure. I've met some clueless people before, but never someone that bad, and I grew up in the southeast. I HOPE that she figures out why what she said was wrong and will never be okay, I really do.

But for some reason, a lot of foolishness seems to be springing up now, wrt to Racefail, and I just don't know what to do about it. People feeling compelled to stick their feet down their throats, saying everybody's behaving badly, and all that jazz, without even reading what started the whole thing, saying it's too complicated and tl;dr. Well, sweetheart, if it's too much for you, don't comment about it; no one's making you regardless of how nervous you feel that everybody's said something and you don't wanna feel like people think you're a racist. And it's not like there aren't half a dozen summaries linked all over the place to give you some perspective.

...and I did not mean to rant all over you. Sorry. *hangs head* This is all getting to me a little.

[elf]

Rant away; I loves a good rant.

And I've done my own share of stupid white girl who doesn't know why everyone's getting so all upset. (I console myself with the awareness that I never shut off contact, and I tried to pay attention even when I thought they were totally off-base.)

Racefail's gotten big enough, and has been going on long enough, that yeah... gonna see a whole bunch of people jumping in and saying I AM AGAINST RACISM but what's with this post here? Or, IAAR and [pick bingo-card statement of choice].

And while eventually, some good will come of this (some people will get clues, and others will join the ban_set list), I wish the people who hated doing Racism 101 had a place to go away to. (Hmm. There's a thought: a roundup com, or a delicious.com collection, of "Teach Racism 101 Opportunities," so people who like going over the basics catch those before they degenerate into back-patting "us white folks all agree we're not racists" threads, and those who are sick of dealing with the basics can skip past those posts.)

There are indeed a dozen summaries. And a couple of hundred other posts. And someone who's *just now noticed*, may miss the summaries entirely (even though a lot of people are nicely linking to "and here's a post explaining what's going on.")

[leana106.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I guess I was just getting used to the surprising lack of fail comments (except for the obvious few) and hell, even Scalzi apologized for his and did one better by actually following up, so that's something.

And while eventually, some good will come of this (some people will get clues, and others will join the ban_set list), I wish the people who hated doing Racism 101 had a place to go away to.

Actually, there's a new comm called racism_101 that just came about because people were sick of starting over every time someone made a new comment. It's on modded membership, which is probably a good idea. I can see it getting trolled a lot. :( I just hope that people stick with the education instead of dropping out when they feel uncomfortable.

[elf]

Ooh, shiny new comm to join!

Here from metafandom

[sistermagpie.livejournal.com]

I notice also that "I have a couple characters who are just as self-righteous as I came off in my OP" only admits to being self-righteous, which was probably not the first word anybody would use to describe what she said. She didn't actually describe her OP as intentionally racist or clueless or an example of white privilege at work.

Ironically if that was the case I'd imagine the people who agreed with the post in the comments would be even more angry for her tricking them into revealing their own racist (in the OP's opinion) sentiments. It was some other poster who even started that whole "Why can't I wear a 'proud to be white' tee-shirt" thread. She just added the "those Duke students got plowed over" etc. comments.

[dharma-slut.livejournal.com]

I know of one other writer who has done something like this-- but NOTHING as heinously abusive. It didn't take long before that guy was 'outed' and when he'd start trolling for reactions other posters would warn the noobs against playing his game.

This woman though... Incredible fail. Incredibly unimaginative, incredibly short-sighted, unbelievably priveleged. She could have gotten all of those reactions from conversations that had already been had, she did not need to incite them one more time.

Instead, she shat right where she lives-- she's had her lj account since 03, and I'd say she took a big old dump right in the middle of her livingroom. Who's going to forgive her for this practical joke?

[hector-rashbaum.livejournal.com]

That kind of surprises me, too; if you're self-aware enough to write that post without believing any of it (I doubt she was; I didn't see any indication that she was capable of lying to that extent, that convincingly...but if) then you would know how badly it's likely to end when you expose yourself.

Why would you do that as anything other than a sockpuppet?

[leana106.livejournal.com]

There's nothing to forgive; it seemed like her friends thought what she wrote was good and the only people who'd objected were those who saw her post via metafandom. Maybe some of them will wake up, but they may have decided to stay away with the header being Racefail; it must be nice having to think about it only when you want to.

[folklorefanatic.livejournal.com]

Thank you for posting about how beyond the pale (Sweet zombie Jeebus, the pun is accurate!) what she did was. Between being too numb to cry and trying not to scream, my mouth was hanging open after reading all of that crap.

[screwthedaisies.livejournal.com]

(Hahahahaha you used "failmarine"--and you put it together with "yellow"! That's even better!!!!)

[hector-rashbaum.livejournal.com]

I think there was a specific reason I came up with that but I don't remember what it was now. Maybe I just had that song stuck in my head? IDK.

[screwthedaisies.livejournal.com]

Well, of all the racial epithets to put in front of "failmarine," "yellow" was the obvious choice. "Dago failmarine" just doesn't have the same je ne sais quoi.

[hector-rashbaum.livejournal.com]

Oh man I was double entendreing and I didn't even know i

[screwthedaisies.livejournal.com]

See, you're so full of win that you win when you're not even thinking about it.